Chinmaya Gharekhan
a former special envoy of Prime Minister Manmohan Singh for West Asia and the West Asia peace process, and a former permanent representative of India to the UN
4 February 2011
Chinmaya Gharekhan, a former special envoy of Prime Minister Manmohan Singh for
West Asia and the West Asia peace process, and a former permanent representative of
India to the United Nations, believes that an outcome of the popular movement in Egypt
will be more power to the people, and, to that extent, India's statement calling for a
resolution acceptable to the Egyptian people should be welcomed. Speaking in an
interview given to Ramesh Ramachandran on Thursday, Mr Gharekhan also said that a
future dispensation in Cairo can be expected to be more sympathetic to the Palestinian
cause. Excerpts:
Why do you think Egypt and what is happening there today should matter to India?
Egypt is the most populous Arab country. Its intellectuals, music and movies dominate
the Arab world, so obviously if you want to have relations with the Arab world, Egypt is
indispensable. It is important because of the energy factor and also because our
economic relations with Egypt has increased of late. IFFCO (Indian Farmers Fertiliser
Cooperative Limited) has a 800 million dollar project there. Egypt was and still is active
in the Non Aligned Movement (NAM). India is a co-founder, with Egypt, of NAM. So we
have many links with Egypt. And, now as we go ahead and look for a permanent seat in
the United Nations Security Council, Egypt again becomes very relevant there. So there
are many reasons for us to be deeply interested in what is going on in Egypt.
What are the likely implications, if any, of the unrest for India?
We still have to wait for the denouement of what is going on in Egypt. One thing is clear
that the end result will be more power to the people of Egypt, more participatory role for
the Egyptian people in the governance of the country. Our bilateral relations will remain
healthy and mutually beneficial, so I don't think we not need to worry about the state of
bilateral relationship with Egypt. However, at the same time, if we were to not show any
interest in the developments going on in Egypt then it would be unfortunate. We were
rather silent in the beginning and then we made some statements which did not really
mean very much. But I think the statements made by external affairs minister SM
Krishna on television removed all doubt about where India stands. He made it very clear
that India is with the people of Egypt and any solution must satisfy the aspirations of the
people of Egypt. He even referred to the writing on the wall, so I think his statements
have been very good.
How do you see the leader-less movement playing itself out in Egypt?
It seems it was very spontaneous. According to an article in the International Herald
Tribune (IHT), apparently a 26-year-old woman (Asmaa Mahfouz) started it. While people
had long been suppressed in Egypt, and it has been a pretty ruthless regime in terms of
political freedoms, it seems that this woman almost risked her life and she put herself in
front of the camera and she asked every one to come out in the streets and protest. It
was very risky for her to upload her own video on the internet because she could have
been arrested and anything could have happened to her but she said she must do what
she thinks she has to do. She shared the video on Facebook, which is read by hundreds
of thousands, so others took courage, and that's how it started. But it had been boiling
for a long time. There was a political movement called Kefaya (Arabic for enough) but
since there is heavy censorship and movements are restricted it does not do well in
elections. So the protests we are seeing today is a genuine popular movement.
How will a potential rise in influence of the Muslim Brotherhood affect Egypt and the
region?
Certainly Israelis would worry about that and there I would agree with them that they
have cause for concern if Muslim Brotherhood comes to power or at least form part of
any future government there. That's understandable because Hamas is an offshoot of
Brotherhood. So I think any future dispensation in Cairo will be much more sympathetic
to the Palestinian cause than the Mubarak regime has been. Of course every Arab
government has to support the Palestinian cause because peoples support the
Palestinians much more than their governments, so to that extent I think the Israelis
might be concerned, but then there is no peace process. There has been no peace
process for some years between the Israelis and the Palestinians so we can't say that it
will affect the peace process. There is no peace process to be affected. Also, in the
neighbouring countries in the Arab world they might get worried and I can understand
that. This is a new force. Then, Muslim Brotherhood, which has been suppressed with an
iron hand in the Mubarak regime, would have more free hand in future. What that has
done immediately is of course to make all these other autocracies realise the dangers to
them and so they are all now coming out with so-called reforms. So I think that's not a
bad thing. Muslim Brotherhood has declared repeatedly, we don't know how long they
will keep to that word, but they say they are against violence and they believe in
democracy.
How likely is it that a future government in Egypt will continue its policies with regard to
Israel or the US?
I'm not an astrologer but any government in Cairo will respect the [1979] peace treaty
with Israel. I totally disagree with Israelis when they say that peace treaty might be
[threatened.] Of course they felt comfortable with Mubarak; he did provide stability and
continuity for a number of years but the treaty was signed by the then Egyptian president
Anwar Sadat and Mubarak only carried on with it. The peace treaty is as much in Egypt's
interest as it is in Israel's interest. It's because of the treaty that Egypt is getting two
billion dollars from the Americans and people of Egypt are not stupid or foolish. But yes,
a future government will certainly be more supportive of the Palestinians.
How would you describe the US response to the unfolding situation in Egypt?
The Americans are the most important external factor. They started off very cautiously
because they didn't know how long it will last but very soon they woke up to the realities
on the ground and now they have taken a very forthright position.
How will the developments in Egypt affect the region in general and Israel - Iran relations
in particular?
The Israelis have to thank themselves for Iran's increasing influence in the region. They
pushed Hamas into Iran's embrace. If the Hamas movement, which won a majority in the
2006 elections, had not been ostracised by the Israelis, and under Israeli pressure by
others, then Iran would have had no foothold with Hamas. So I think Israelis should do
some introspection themselves and see what is at the root of all this: it's the continued
occupation of Palestine, plus their deliberately pushing Hamas into isolation and hence
into the arms of Iran. They have to take responsibility for that.
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